How Karsai Restores Blood, Qi, and Energy Flow to the Genitalia Naturally.  

Rahi: Welcome to Organic Sexuality, where we explore the restoration of pleasure, the reclamation of sexual sovereignty and the realization of our embodied sexual nature. An invitation to honor the pleasures of your body by embodying the pleasures of your nature. I'm your host, Rahi Chun. I'm a certified somatic sex educator, sexological body worker and creator of Somatic Sexual Wholeness.

Rahi: In today's episode, we explore the ancient practice of Nuad Karsai also called Karsai Nei Tsang and Abdominal Detox Massage also called Chi Nei Tsang, with one of the most experienced practitioners of these arts, Coocky Tassanee Boonsom. Coocky shares the importance of restoring and nourishing the Sen line 10, the Energy Meridian of the body which restores the natural Qi, blood, and energy flow into the genitalia, which can resolve a wide range of issues such as a lack of lubrication, proper engorgement of the labia and clitoris, and fertility issues in Vulva-owners, and erection challenges, ejaculation issues, and low libido in Penis-owners. At the end of the episode, we discuss ways to engage and open the Sen line 10 with self-massage. Today's episode is accompanied with a video demonstration showing a full Karsai session facilitated on a Vulva-owner and a Penis-owner to provide a context for today's interview. The video can be found on this podcast episode's page@organicsexualitypodcast.com.

Rahi: So today I'm very, very pleased to be inviting one of my teachers who I met in Thailand in the North, She runs the Loi Kroh Traditional Massage Thai Yoga and Massage School in Chiang Mai. And I specifically sought her out because she's one of the most experienced practitioners in these ancient Taoist Arts - the abdominal organ detox massage, also called Chi Nei Tsang in some circles and the Nuad Karsai,, also sometimes called Karsai Nei Tsang. Coocky, thank you so much for joining us today.

Coocky: I thank you for your

Rahi: Yes, of course, of course. So Coocky is in France at the moment. I really appreciate she joining us. So Coocky, I want to start by asking, you've had such an interesting life's journey of healing and being exposed to healing way back from your grandmother's sister, who was the midwife in the town you grew up in and assisting and witnessing the work that she did, delivering babies, all the way up to founding and being the lead instructor at your school. I'd like to ask you, what were some of the most influential or important experiences that shaped your journey as a teacher and as a practitioner?

Coocky: Well, thank you. I hope I can answer your question. Yes. (I was a) Thai massage teacher or practitioner, you know, for a long time.... And, I wanted to deepen - To the root of the sen line that traditional Thai massage - we have, you know, sen lines - at the navel, but in Thai massage, we don't practice so much in this area in the abdominal area or the stomach area - sen line number 10, because it's connected to your sexual organs and to your lower abdomen, and I find Chi Nei Tsang, or Nuad Karsai - it really works to deeply unblock this area, which is Thai massage don't touch this area. Really.

Rahi: So you were, it sounds like you were really interested in engaging that sen line 10, that goes from the navel to the pubic bone, right? Yeah. Right. So in acupuncture and acupressure, you know, it's called different things - "the sea of intimacy" - but it really stimulates the energy and blood into the genitalia and really the whole pelvis. So you were saying Thai massage does not engage in that line from the navel to the pubic bone. And you were interested in really nourishing and healing the blood flow into the pelvis. So you sought out the Abdominal Detox and Nuad Karsai

Coocky: Well, the Thai massage in my generation - it may have been practiced in the old generation, but in my generation, just kind of avoid massaging this area. It's like, for example, at Wat Po, they are working in the temple, so in this area, it's kind of a... they teach us the theory - the energy lines, how, where it starts - from the navel to the pubis, and so on and so on, but practically they don't teach, you know really. So, if you ever receive Thai massage, what they do is just have work, and stop at the groins, and then they stop and they return and they just taughtt, wow, they just massage the stomach, but not really deep as the Karsai work or the abdominal work.

Rahi: Um, yeah. Yeah. And that line is just so, so vital. It's like the main line to make sure there's healthy energy and blood flow going into the penis and the clitoris and the, you know, really the tissues that make up the genitalia.

Coocky: Yes, yes. And this area - very, very important to clear. And, you know, many people have blockages in this area and we avoid to, you know, massage... And also the important that, myself, I had a hernia operation on my navel and between the pubic bone and the Naval. So if I had an operation at young age and well, I've got Chi Nei Tsang and Karsai - it really helped me, it really helped me. Yes.

Rahi: Okay. So there was both an interest as a healer and your own healing journey after your own hernia. Uh, it sounds like it was an operation.

Coocky: Yes. I had an operation at a young age.

Rahi: So then I'm guessing that the Chi Nei Tsang and Karsai - really helped to restore the healthy blood flow and Qi flow in your own body, in the lower abdominal and pelvic areas

Coocky: Exactly. Yes. Yes.

Rahi: So that's really wonderful, Coocky. So you actually, - your body experienced the benefits of these practices at an early age, and I'm guessing it gave you a better understanding of how to practice on others.

Coocky: Yes. Through my experience.. Learning from my - my body actually.

Rahi: Our bodies are the best teachers, so I do want to - so just for the listeners to understand, Nuad Karsai - Karsai Nei Tsang... So "Karsai" actually refers to the sedimentation. There are crystal-like sedimentation in the veins, and these can form really anywhere in the body, but Nuad Karsai, yes, but Nuad Karsai really focuses on the effects of the sedimentation that affects the genitalia and the pelvis. And it's really a sensing and releasing of any sedimentation. They could show up as not like little lumps or tangles, which restrict the natural movement of organs. And this can affect anything from - for a man. It can result in erection issues or unhealthy or low libido, In the female. It can affect really improper lubrication, lack of engorgement of the labia and clitoris. It can affect fertility issues or hormone balance - painful sex, and it's really, you know, Coocky for me, the easiest way for me to say it is it's restoring healthy blood and Qi flow in the pelvis for healthy genitalia. That's generally how I explain it. Is there, is there something, is there a different way that you explain it?

Coocky: Well, exactly like you, what you were explaining is absolutely yes, yes. Or explanation.

Rahi: Good. I'm glad I got it. Yeah, for me, that's the easiest way to explain it. And what I really love about what I learned at your school was how important it is to open the blood and channels in all the organs, through opening the eight wind Gates and the Tan Tien - to make sure there is a space for the toxicity to go. Yeah, I found it really fascinating how, because you start by opening up the blood flow above the pelvis, and then also from below the pelvis with the adductors and the thighs and the femoral artery points, there's a really healthy reservoir - body of fresh blood before getting to massaging the genitalia. It's just such a wise preparation, so that there's a lot of healthy blood and energy to flush open the sedimentation in the pelvis. So I want to ask you Coocky - what are some of the most common reasons that clients come to you for Karsai for Nuad Karsai? Both for men and for women.

Coocky: Okay. Well first, of course, by curiosity - there are some people who want to find out, Oh, what is Karsai, you know, Well just curiosity... and then they've got something also, you know, pretty Tim. Um, so it's also to maintain the sexual energy sexual, uh, ability... and some woman, uh, to prepare, to have a baby, you know, prepare her body to go, to get a baby. Women who, I mean, elder woman or middle age, a woman can't hold urine and opposite for the man - . they can't, you cannot urinate fluently, you know, like, uh, maybe prostate swollen, you know, like that. Yeah. And of course, they don't say, "I have a prostate (issue) and I want to have this massage.". No, it is by massaging you... would feel that the prostate is a bit more swollen than usually then the person then have a difficulty with urinating for the man. And of course, to soften the scar tissue like me, you know - I got, I got the case he had, operation - it's not really operation, you know, on his penis, you know, to keep clean.

Rahi: Yeah, so it was a circumcision...

Coocky: And to keep clean. So after he got, when his penis get reaction - is not really straight - . It's like, the scar tissue is pulling when he get erection, so you got to massage and, uh, like what you say, you know, uh, low libido, you know, low sexual thing, and they want to keep this in a natural way,

Rahi: Kind of natural vitality. So Coocky, it sounds like a lot of men will come - one, out of curiosity, but also sometimes for an unhealthy or enlarged prostate. Um, so they have difficulty urinating, but they don't realize that it's the enlarged prostate that's causing the, the trouble with urination. It also sounds like men will come to increase their vitality. And I'm guessing that means increasing the blood flow, the energy.

Coocky: Yes. But in Chiang Mai, I really got men who really, had, you know, this prostate problem, you know, it's, you're surprised that so many people don't want to have a prostate operation, you know, like, prostate cancer, you know, they don't want to have an operation, so they -- yeah. They're looking for this treatment - in a natural way - which seems to help, yeah.

Rahi: Well, there are so many natural ways to heal and address issues like an enlarged prostate for men, or like, you know, excess, heavy bleeding for women. Here in America, if a woman goes to their doctor and they're bleeding heavily during their period, the doctor will recommend a hysterectomy, an operation to remove, you know, the uterus. And I feel like, I mean, that's the uterus trying to pump usually often it's the uterus trying to pump old blood stuck to its walls out of the way. And I feel like practices like Nuad Karsai can address these things naturally by increasing the blood flow and resolving these blocks in the, in the organs, whether it's the prostate or testicles for men or the uterus and any obstructions in the vaginal canal for women.

Coocky: Oh, also, you know, when you talk about uterus for women and also women who have lower back pain - it's a cause of uterus dislocation, you know, so by massaging or lifting the uterus, it helps, you know. I mean, when the uterus is not extremely dislocated.

Rahi: And you mentioned earlier the Nuad Karsai can support a prolapsed bladder as well. I think that's what you meant when you talked about female urination issues. Yes. Yeah. You know it really surprised me when I was in your training and we were doing the Nuad Karsai for men, and I was partnered with Hayato-san - just within two days, his blood flow increased significantly. And it makes so much sense because we're clearing the pathways, for the blood to not only move into the genitalia, but really to move into the pelvis from the torso as well as from the legs on up. I'm curious Coocky, I know you guys have a studio in France, Le Lotus Blanc. Yeah. Do you find that the issues that clients come with are different in France than in Thailand?

Coocky: Well, they are not, not quite different. They're similar, very similar. I must say. I mean in Thailand, well, people come from around the world for massage, but here,, most of them are French people, but there are similar problems. Yeah.

Rahi: Yes. So the, the body is the body, no matter what culture it's from and it's the same issues. Right. So we should let our listeners know that there are many causes to the sedimentation, the knots and the tangles from toxins in our environment, toxins in the food we eat. But Coocky - would you say that the primary reason is emotional toxicity or emotional trauma? So I know there are many reasons for the sedimentation and the knots and tangles to occur in the genitalia - really anywhere in the body including toxins in the environment, and the food we eat, but it seems like emotional toxins, repressed, anger, fear, you know, conflict seems to be, you know, would you say that's the main reason

Coocky: That this also part of the big, big thing - stress. I mean the negative feeling in all the mind's choice or body's choice and you know what, because stress, I mean stress - we keep the stress in the negative way, but it really brings this energy, you know, It's because stress energy, it really give us, you know, many, many blockages in our body, our minds, our.. life

Rahi: Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure, sure. Because the body is feeling all of those unexpressed or repressed emotions, and we know that, you know, the body responds by contracting when it's stressed. So the muscles around the nerves or around, so the, you know, the nerves, the, the blood vessels, the circulatory system can all become contracted. And that's when the sedimentation, knots and tangles can happen.

Coocky: Yes. And, you know, in Thai, we also have, you know, we have four elements that are different elements than Chinese. We have four elements, you know, we have Eath, Water, Wind, Fire, you know. For the sexual energy. Um, we call it Fire. That is a fire element. . So, when you have, when we say wind - we have low sexual energy, we have - in Thai words, we say, Khun Mai Mee Fye - it means - you have no Fire,

Rahi: No fire, no fire. Yeah.

Coocky: Yeah. That is the sexual energy. I mean, your elements in your body is also important. If one of your elements is out of order... . Uh, yeah. - It gives you problems too.

Rahi: Sure. An imbalance. Yeah. So it sounds like the no fire is related to the lack of proper blood and Qi flow. Right. And I'm guessing that there are emotions that relate with all of these elements.

Coocky: Yes. Yes. The earth element, the water element, the wind element and fire element. Yeah,

Rahi: Yeah. Yeah. It's a very deep, and it's such a wise lineage. And just to let listeners know the Nuad Karsai and the Chi Nei Tsang - the inner abdominal detox - the roots are, are Taoists right. They're Taoists ancient practices.

Coocky: The root, if you want to say yes. You can say Taoists, yes. I mean, back to the Thai massage - we also call that in traditional Thai Massage, the 10 main lines, you know, that line number ten is also there, but only it in my generation, they don't teach me how to touch this area.

Rahi: That's amazing because I, you know, I, in some of my other trainings, that's like the most important line that's that's - line 10 is where the Tan Tien is.

Coocky: I don't want to say yes. And I don't want to say no, and because we also have line 10.

Rahi: Okay. I see. Okay. So

Coocky: No teacher is, I mean, today, I don't find Thai teacher who teach me how to work on the really, you know, like that. But I find Mantak Chia well, and Khun Ni and Khun Nom who is specialized in the Karsai and they work on this area. And I find somehow, it connects. I mean, yeah. At Tao Gardens, they call it Taoists, yes...

Rahi: Yeah, that's right. Yeah. At Tao Gardens, they emphasize the Taoists,.. but I see. Yeah. So many of these practices, the wisdom comes from different sources. Of course at Tao gardens, they will say it's a Taoist lineage. So, Coocky, and I studied, so she's referring to Master Mantak Chia, where, they have Tao Gardens and Khun Ni - who is considered like a Sharman. She has her own approach as well. Coocky - I want to ask you, during our training, you had told me about experiences like when you and your patient will see the same images as you're releasing toxins from their organs, without talking to each other, you will see the same images. Um, and you shared an experience of working on a client, a male client, where you saw images of death and suffering of soldiers. And after the session, he had the same images. Because to me that speaks to how the practitioner is able to feel into the energy and sense the energy of the patient at the same time. Can you share other experiences like that if they've happened?

Coocky: Yes. This happens often when the receiver is really there to receive and to feel their body - and to feel their body, at the same times when, when I apply the technique and that is, there's a connection, some kind of deeper state of consciousness, you know, that we - have the same image that can often yeah - with mine. And sometimes, so each or kind of lost someone, you know, someone in the family is passed away and the person's still hold, you know, they sadness, this grief in the body without realizing that deep, deep sadness is still there. And just once you've got this technique of, abdominal work and it's kind of - touch it, or I must say free, you know, uh, like, the person get the chance to, to free to let go of, this holding thing for years.

Rahi: So

Coocky: That's especially when you touch the psoas muscle, you know, often - this is show up very deep.

Rahi: Yeah. Wait, which muscle did you say? The psoas muscle, yes, of course. Yes. So the, the, psoas muscle is known, at least in some of the trainings I've been at is known to hold, unprocessed traumas and repressed emotions, because it's so deep and it's so vulnerable. Yes.

Coocky: Many therapists and many massage practitioners avoid touching this area because it's hard to deal with.

Rahi: Yes, yes, that's right. That's right. Yeah. It's, it's hard to deal with because of the unprocessed emotions that are waiting to be freed, but also, uh, it's underneath many layers of two, it's underneath other layers of muscles. So, you know, you have to really know how to get to it.

Coocky: Yeah. Yes. Especially work with a bodybuilder.

Rahi: Yeah, yeah - that was, I got to say, I think that was one of the funnest parts of the training for me, was getting to the psoas. You know, the Tibetan culture call the psoas muscle, the muscle of the soul. Yes. Yeah, yeah. It's, it's profound. So I feel like what you're speaking to, when you talk about touching into the consciousness of the patient and the unprocessed emotions that is waiting to be freed - you're really, you've developed such a ability to listen, which with your hands, ability to listen and be present with your touch, that that meeting allows - I mean, of course there's technique, but the safety that you hold and the presence that you bring to it, feels like it's very important in, in freeing those emotions and stagnation.

Coocky: Yeah. And the same time, you must, protect yourself. You must have your boundary when doing this deeper healing you know, deeper that you do not interfere. I mean, not to get, how you call it ?... to get... You are there - touching the person, but at the same time, you are not in their field, you know, you are out of them - not mixing in their story, in their past, or in their emotions. Yeah. I mean, the word is neutral. Yeah. Neutral, and touching the ground. I mean, you must be really grounded.

Rahi: Yeah, So both you and your teachings and, Mantak Chia's teachings emphasize the real importance of using the universal life force energy and not your own personal energy, because exactly what you're speaking to, to not mix your energy with the client, but to hold a safe, neutral space - the importance of using, of clearing your, at your, your energy field before and after sessions. Coocky, have you seen some dangerous things happen when people are using their own personal energy?

Coocky: Yes. Yes. It can join. It can - you can feel really exhausted and after it...

Rahi: Because you're taking on that, that energy, it's almost like a open container that's taking on the energy, the negative energy of the client.

Coocky: Yes. When you're energy is different, and when your Client releases negative stuff, which is not the same as yours - I mean, the different levels of a Wave I call it - if you don't have the same wave, you're gonna get it, if you are the light and if there's a darkness coming out and you are light...

Rahi: Yeah.. So there's an emphasis on clearing your energy, energy practices, like Qi gong and Tai Chi, and really connecting to the earth and nature. Exactly.. Yeah. Coocky - before we end our conversation today, I'm wondering if you can share some advice to our listeners for how we all can keep our reproductive centers healthy with healthy blood and Qi flow.

Coocky: Yes. The first very simple exercise that you can keep this area healthy. I think most of people know Mula Bandha -, that is a root lock, or a contraction of the perineum. You know, contracted., You know, you can men and women's - you can do anywhere, but either sitting or standing or even talking or cooking or anywhere, you know, so you just contract and do it as much as you can - and every day, and it's very simple.... .

Rahi: Yeah. It's very simple. And you can do it anywhere. And it makes sure that the blood flow is healthy and that the muscle of the pelvic floor remains dexterous and healthy as well. Yes. Coocky - I wanted to ask you the line 10, the line going from the belly button to the pubic bone, do you recommend that we press into that line to increase the blood flow?

Coocky: Yes. Um, you can, you can do like self-massage. . I mean, not only on that - I call it that six o'clock, you know, not only that place, I mean, you can do in general, the Chi Nei Tsang uh, or the Karsai - you know, the self massage, the technique that you can practice on yourself - daily, or when you get a chance.

Rahi: So, you know, before going to bed, or maybe before you get out of bed in the morning, you can certainly massage your internal intestinal organs feeling for any lumps or bumps and just doing small loving circles or holding and releasing. But that line from the navel to the pubic bone, which we referred to before, it can really increase the blood flow and energy flow into the pelvic floor. Coocky - Coocky is not your real name. How did you get the nickname Coocky?

Coocky: I probably, I like to eat cookies, but today I'm like I love cooking today and planting. But actually in Thai, we call cook, you know, just cook and key is - I got it from the father of my daughter that he called me - just to make it smaller, like a cookie.

Rahi: Oh, I see. Okay. And your real name is Tassanee Boonsom. But I love Coocky and everybody calls calls her Coocky. Um, yeah, and I think it fits you so well. Coocky - thank you so much for sharing your journey and your insights and your, just your knowledge with us today. It's really so valuable, so important

Rahi: That we keep our reproductive centers healthy,, and natural ways that the body responds to.

Coocky: It's my pleasure. You're welcome. Thanks to you for the interview.

Rahi: Of course, of course, Coocky, thank you again for being with us. And if listeners are curious at all, Loi Kroh Massage offers a real wide range of traditional time massages from Osteo-Thai to reflexology, to the practices we just spoke about - the inner Abdominal Detox Massage and the Inner Genital Massage. Yeah. If you want to learn more, please visit those sites. Loi Kroh massage. Yeah. So that's L O I K R O H massage.com and Le Lotus Blanc. Coocky. Thank you so much. I hope to, yeah, I hope to see you again soon.

Coocky: Thank you very much Rahi, Thank you Sawadee-Kaa.

Rahi: Sawadee-Krap.

Rahi: Notice how this episode is landing in your body, and if any part of your body is calling for touch, support, or attention, what it feels like to provide this to your body,

Rahi: If you feel called to explore your Sen Kitchanna, the Sen Line 10, it can be self-massaged, when lying on your back. Simply envision the Energy Meridian line going from the base of your navel down to the center of your pubic bone. You can explore any points along this line, including the Southern most Wind gate about one quarter centimeter below the navel, or the Tan Tien - about one and a half inches below the navel, or at the other end of the Sen line, just above your pubic bone center at the indentation point where your pubic bone dips into the soft fleshy part of your lower abdomen. Simply press into any of these points along the line with one or both index or middle fingers. And when this is done quite deeply, a pulse can often be felt, especially at the Tan Tien point. And simply hold the point on this line for one to two minutes, then release. Often a fresh flow of blood and Qi can be felt moving along the Sen line and into the genitalia and pelvis. This can be practiced in bed before sleeping or upon waking, or even during self-pleasuring to explore the different arousal and pleasure sensations available when stimulating your Qi flow.

Rahi: When doing so notice whether there's energy movement that can be felt along the Sen line or within your genitalia and pelvis after stimulating points along this Energy Meridian, however, subtle or pronounced, and notice how this feels in your body.

Rahi: In the next episode, we explore the perspective of a Western OB/GYN, my dear friend, Dr. Jen Lang, and how her natural birthing experience deeply changed her life and her approach to delivering babies for her clients and how the holistic approaches to pelvic care we've been exploring in these last episodes can co-exist with a Western approach to reproductive care. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, share with your tribe or leave a review by subscribing@organicsexualitypodcast.com. You'll also receive additional insights from the episodes as well as the free organic sexuality ebook until next time, take good care.